1 00:00:03,169 --> 00:00:02,389 and it hits me oh my gosh this is that 2 00:00:04,280 --> 00:00:03,179 triangle 3 00:00:05,360 --> 00:00:04,290 you know there's explanation for 4 00:00:06,710 --> 00:00:05,370 everything that occurred in the 5 00:00:09,169 --> 00:00:06,720 Rendlesham forest incident 6 00:00:12,049 --> 00:00:09,179 it doesn't involve aliens at all it was 7 00:00:15,379 --> 00:00:12,059 completely silent it comes right over 8 00:00:17,210 --> 00:00:15,389 our head it's so classic flying-saucer 9 00:00:18,830 --> 00:00:17,220 really standing in the clearing he 10 00:00:20,510 --> 00:00:18,840 turned over to my father and held his 11 00:00:24,140 --> 00:00:20,520 hand and he looked in his eyes and said 12 00:00:27,529 --> 00:00:24,150 we're not alone hello and welcome to the 13 00:00:29,540 --> 00:00:27,539 show the show we call podcast UFO I'm 14 00:00:31,130 --> 00:00:29,550 Martin Willis I'm your host and I have 15 00:00:33,410 --> 00:00:31,140 some good news and bad news 16 00:00:35,090 --> 00:00:33,420 I never know which one of those darn 17 00:00:37,819 --> 00:00:35,100 things to say first so I'm going to say 18 00:00:40,310 --> 00:00:37,829 the bad news we're not live today our 19 00:00:42,319 --> 00:00:40,320 guest Lee Spiegel well he has a 20 00:00:44,510 --> 00:00:42,329 conflicting schedule and we had to 21 00:00:47,240 --> 00:00:44,520 record ahead of time a little more bad 22 00:00:50,090 --> 00:00:47,250 news Lee and I talked so much that we're 23 00:00:52,910 --> 00:00:50,100 not able to leave any room for Alejandro 24 00:00:56,299 --> 00:00:52,920 Rojas is UFO news but he'll be back next 25 00:00:57,500 --> 00:00:56,309 week now for the good news I think it's 26 00:00:59,299 --> 00:00:57,510 a great interview and I know you're 27 00:01:01,790 --> 00:00:59,309 really gonna like it 28 00:01:05,210 --> 00:01:01,800 I've had a lot of respect for Lee over 29 00:01:08,600 --> 00:01:05,220 the years he's a real solid guy and more 30 00:01:10,940 --> 00:01:08,610 good news he will be back next month 31 00:01:12,800 --> 00:01:10,950 sometime in November I'm not sure what 32 00:01:15,830 --> 00:01:12,810 that date will be but he'll be live at 33 00:01:18,950 --> 00:01:15,840 that point and I'll be in the chat room 34 00:01:21,590 --> 00:01:18,960 live this evening and I did mention it 35 00:01:24,260 --> 00:01:21,600 to Lee himself to see if he could he is 36 00:01:26,270 --> 00:01:24,270 commuting while this show is live and 37 00:01:27,770 --> 00:01:26,280 hopefully he's on the training might be 38 00:01:30,590 --> 00:01:27,780 able to pop in but there's certainly no 39 00:01:32,600 --> 00:01:30,600 promises there next week of course we'll 40 00:01:35,870 --> 00:01:32,610 be back live at 9 p.m. Eastern Standard 41 00:01:38,480 --> 00:01:35,880 Time as I said last week I plan on being 42 00:01:40,249 --> 00:01:38,490 at the New England UFO conference again 43 00:01:42,770 --> 00:01:40,259 this year and it's being held in 44 00:01:44,899 --> 00:01:42,780 Leominster Massachusetts and it's coming 45 00:01:48,889 --> 00:01:44,909 right up on the night about Friday 46 00:01:51,170 --> 00:01:48,899 October 17th and Saturday the 18th and I 47 00:01:53,990 --> 00:01:51,180 will post a link on our website and our 48 00:01:56,539 --> 00:01:54,000 show notes Stanton Friedman Kathy Martin 49 00:01:58,399 --> 00:01:56,549 Peter Robbins mark D Antonio the iNOS 50 00:02:01,249 --> 00:01:58,409 and many more I'll be upstairs with the 51 00:02:03,560 --> 00:02:01,259 Eno's for a good part may be recording 52 00:02:05,870 --> 00:02:03,570 with a few of the speakers there I'm 53 00:02:08,719 --> 00:02:05,880 gonna break down and where my podcast 54 00:02:11,660 --> 00:02:08,729 UFO t-shirt as well as my Exeter New 55 00:02:13,339 --> 00:02:11,670 Hampshire UFO hat so you'll be able to 56 00:02:14,020 --> 00:02:13,349 spot me easily and please don't be shy 57 00:02:17,230 --> 00:02:14,030 come 58 00:02:18,880 --> 00:02:17,240 and say hello well that's it we're ready 59 00:02:21,910 --> 00:02:18,890 for our interview right now with Lee 60 00:02:22,960 --> 00:02:21,920 Spiegel well I'm on skype with someone 61 00:02:26,710 --> 00:02:22,970 I've been trying to get on the show for 62 00:02:28,990 --> 00:02:26,720 a long time Lee Spiegel how are you I'm 63 00:02:31,480 --> 00:02:29,000 fine Martin and you haven't tried hard 64 00:02:34,000 --> 00:02:31,490 enough I don't think well I did because 65 00:02:35,350 --> 00:02:34,010 it finally worked here you are by the 66 00:02:37,060 --> 00:02:35,360 way since I know we're going to become 67 00:02:40,750 --> 00:02:37,070 good friends 68 00:02:42,760 --> 00:02:40,760 I would you prefer Martin or Marty you 69 00:02:46,930 --> 00:02:42,770 know I when I was growing up I was Marty 70 00:02:49,930 --> 00:02:46,940 but I'm too old for to be Marty 71 00:02:51,190 --> 00:02:49,940 so Martin if that's all right Martin it 72 00:02:54,580 --> 00:02:51,200 is okay all right 73 00:02:56,740 --> 00:02:54,590 you're a level-headed guy and I really 74 00:02:59,080 --> 00:02:56,750 paid attention to to the work you've 75 00:03:01,930 --> 00:02:59,090 done you've done some great work and I 76 00:03:04,840 --> 00:03:01,940 want to know what got you started in the 77 00:03:06,490 --> 00:03:04,850 whole paranormal UFO subject to begin 78 00:03:09,520 --> 00:03:06,500 with you've been at it a very long time 79 00:03:13,810 --> 00:03:09,530 I have thank you thank you for for the 80 00:03:18,250 --> 00:03:13,820 nice words about that I well growing up 81 00:03:20,350 --> 00:03:18,260 in New Hampshire I grew up not far from 82 00:03:23,860 --> 00:03:20,360 where the famous Betty and Barney Hill 83 00:03:26,800 --> 00:03:23,870 UFO abduction case took place so in New 84 00:03:28,870 --> 00:03:26,810 Hampshire you know we get those crisp 85 00:03:31,720 --> 00:03:28,880 amazing skies at night you can always 86 00:03:34,390 --> 00:03:31,730 see weird strange things and and also 87 00:03:38,380 --> 00:03:34,400 just growing up I was basically a child 88 00:03:41,440 --> 00:03:38,390 of the 50s and so I loved being scared 89 00:03:46,420 --> 00:03:41,450 by all the earth vs. the flying saucer 90 00:03:49,570 --> 00:03:46,430 movies invaders from Mars the thing from 91 00:03:51,520 --> 00:03:49,580 another world I mean I was just loving 92 00:03:53,320 --> 00:03:51,530 that stuff as much as it scared me I 93 00:03:55,810 --> 00:03:53,330 didn't know what to make of it I I don't 94 00:03:58,240 --> 00:03:55,820 think I ever really considered that that 95 00:04:01,330 --> 00:03:58,250 there might actually be people or beings 96 00:04:03,009 --> 00:04:01,340 coming from somewhere else with whatever 97 00:04:05,110 --> 00:04:03,019 reason is that they add whether they 98 00:04:08,680 --> 00:04:05,120 were here to to be friends with us or do 99 00:04:11,410 --> 00:04:08,690 eat us I didn't care I just liked 100 00:04:12,940 --> 00:04:11,420 reading about these things and seeing 101 00:04:17,140 --> 00:04:12,950 movies about it when I was growing up 102 00:04:22,360 --> 00:04:17,150 and so I actually I found my way to New 103 00:04:25,750 --> 00:04:22,370 York in 1970 from New Hampshire I was a 104 00:04:27,400 --> 00:04:25,760 folk singer and and I went to New York 105 00:04:29,310 --> 00:04:27,410 with a suitcase and guitar 106 00:04:34,720 --> 00:04:29,320 I was right out of a Paul Simon songbook 107 00:04:38,590 --> 00:04:34,730 and and I went to New York with the idea 108 00:04:41,290 --> 00:04:38,600 with the target of getting a record 109 00:04:44,400 --> 00:04:41,300 album deal somewhere all focusing is all 110 00:04:47,650 --> 00:04:44,410 performers want that record album deal 111 00:04:50,470 --> 00:04:47,660 and so I went there and was performing 112 00:04:52,990 --> 00:04:50,480 for a few years I even met a guy who 113 00:04:55,150 --> 00:04:53,000 wanted to be my manager but he wanted to 114 00:05:03,130 --> 00:04:55,160 change my name from Lee Spiegel to happy 115 00:05:09,970 --> 00:05:03,140 day I think the Edwin Hawkins singers oh 116 00:05:12,220 --> 00:05:09,980 happy days and he didn't really stay as 117 00:05:14,920 --> 00:05:12,230 my manager very long because I I had 118 00:05:17,380 --> 00:05:14,930 this this vision of me being introduced 119 00:05:22,710 --> 00:05:17,390 on stage as happy day with a big red 120 00:05:25,090 --> 00:05:22,720 clown nose and big big floppy clown feet 121 00:05:33,760 --> 00:05:25,100 the direction I want to go in thank you 122 00:05:37,510 --> 00:05:33,770 very much but know what in 1973-74 I was 123 00:05:41,140 --> 00:05:37,520 working in New York as a salesperson at 124 00:05:46,000 --> 00:05:41,150 the big music chain franchise called Sam 125 00:05:48,370 --> 00:05:46,010 Ash and lots of famous musicians would 126 00:05:51,610 --> 00:05:48,380 come in all the time buying all their 127 00:05:54,159 --> 00:05:51,620 instruments and things there and and I 128 00:05:56,200 --> 00:05:54,169 was and I was selling instruments and 129 00:06:00,330 --> 00:05:56,210 musical things and it was about this 130 00:06:03,220 --> 00:06:00,340 time 1973 that the United States 131 00:06:08,020 --> 00:06:03,230 experienced what we we know as we 132 00:06:10,300 --> 00:06:08,030 referred to as a UFO flap or a wave you 133 00:06:13,870 --> 00:06:10,310 UFOs were being seen all around the 134 00:06:18,190 --> 00:06:13,880 country they were showing up on a news 135 00:06:19,930 --> 00:06:18,200 broadcast even major talk shows where 136 00:06:22,960 --> 00:06:19,940 we're interviewing people I mean the 137 00:06:25,120 --> 00:06:22,970 very first one of the first shows that I 138 00:06:25,900 --> 00:06:25,130 saw that featured this was the Dick 139 00:06:30,220 --> 00:06:25,910 Cavett show 140 00:06:34,030 --> 00:06:30,230 oh yeah ABC's yeah Dick Cavett had on 141 00:06:37,270 --> 00:06:34,040 one of his shows a helicopter commander 142 00:06:40,410 --> 00:06:37,280 from the Army named Larry coin 143 00:06:44,190 --> 00:06:40,420 who had one of the most amazing 144 00:06:47,830 --> 00:06:44,200 terrifying UFO encounters of all time 145 00:06:51,129 --> 00:06:47,840 that involved yeah he was the commander 146 00:06:54,159 --> 00:06:51,139 of a four man army helicopter crew they 147 00:06:56,379 --> 00:06:54,169 were flying above Ohio and and they saw 148 00:06:58,600 --> 00:06:56,389 this object coming at them from the 149 00:07:01,600 --> 00:06:58,610 horizon it was a red light and it was on 150 00:07:03,879 --> 00:07:01,610 a collision course on their helicopter 151 00:07:05,409 --> 00:07:03,889 and they all they all thought the thing 152 00:07:08,860 --> 00:07:05,419 was going to collide with them they 153 00:07:11,920 --> 00:07:08,870 braced for impact and and instead of the 154 00:07:14,620 --> 00:07:11,930 UFO colliding with them it stopped and 155 00:07:17,290 --> 00:07:14,630 hovered directly above their helicopter 156 00:07:20,260 --> 00:07:17,300 and and they could see at that point as 157 00:07:23,470 --> 00:07:20,270 it was hovering it was a total cigar 158 00:07:26,320 --> 00:07:23,480 shape it had no wings no vertical or 159 00:07:30,850 --> 00:07:26,330 horizontal stabilizers no tail just a 160 00:07:35,440 --> 00:07:30,860 cigar shape and as they were there in 161 00:07:38,500 --> 00:07:35,450 the helicopter from the front of the UFO 162 00:07:41,620 --> 00:07:38,510 a green light came out a shot a beam of 163 00:07:44,530 --> 00:07:41,630 light into the cockpit of the copter it 164 00:07:48,010 --> 00:07:44,540 bathed all of their instrument panel in 165 00:07:49,930 --> 00:07:48,020 a green glow and and they didn't know 166 00:07:52,480 --> 00:07:49,940 what to do they were all totally scared 167 00:07:54,969 --> 00:07:52,490 and then all of a sudden they could feel 168 00:07:57,909 --> 00:07:54,979 that the UFO was above them and it 169 00:08:00,400 --> 00:07:57,919 started pulling them up into the sky she 170 00:08:02,500 --> 00:08:00,410 straightened up and and they they 171 00:08:05,050 --> 00:08:02,510 figured out that they went up something 172 00:08:07,120 --> 00:08:05,060 like 3,000 feet in a matter of seconds 173 00:08:08,409 --> 00:08:07,130 and they didn't know it and and they 174 00:08:10,930 --> 00:08:08,419 were going higher and higher and then 175 00:08:13,600 --> 00:08:10,940 there was a bump where the UFO 176 00:08:16,090 --> 00:08:13,610 apparently you said okay I've had enough 177 00:08:18,790 --> 00:08:16,100 with you guys and and it except them go 178 00:08:21,360 --> 00:08:18,800 and the UFO went in one direction and 179 00:08:25,770 --> 00:08:21,370 the copter went in another direction and 180 00:08:28,960 --> 00:08:25,780 and Larry coin radioed ahead and said 181 00:08:30,940 --> 00:08:28,970 we're coming in and have the press there 182 00:08:34,659 --> 00:08:30,950 we want to tell what just happened to us 183 00:08:39,040 --> 00:08:34,669 and the the army actually allowed them 184 00:08:41,170 --> 00:08:39,050 to talk to the media and and one of the 185 00:08:43,990 --> 00:08:41,180 reasons for that was because there were 186 00:08:47,650 --> 00:08:44,000 eyewitnesses on the ground that saw the 187 00:08:47,920 --> 00:08:47,660 whole thing as well it was like here you 188 00:08:50,960 --> 00:08:47,930 go 189 00:08:53,269 --> 00:08:50,970 form an army helicopter 190 00:08:56,329 --> 00:08:53,279 Kru they have this an amazing encounter 191 00:08:58,160 --> 00:08:56,339 we don't have anything technologically 192 00:09:02,360 --> 00:08:58,170 that can that can do what that object 193 00:09:06,620 --> 00:09:02,370 did and they couldn't they couldn't deny 194 00:09:09,350 --> 00:09:06,630 it and so coin started appearing on 195 00:09:11,930 --> 00:09:09,360 different shows and I saw him on the 196 00:09:14,780 --> 00:09:11,940 Dick Cavett show and I want wow the this 197 00:09:17,660 --> 00:09:14,790 guy is amazing and I kind of put that in 198 00:09:19,400 --> 00:09:17,670 the back of my mind just that I was so 199 00:09:21,980 --> 00:09:19,410 impressed by him and then there were 200 00:09:24,380 --> 00:09:21,990 other stories and I started reading a 201 00:09:28,970 --> 00:09:24,390 lot of books that were available at the 202 00:09:32,360 --> 00:09:28,980 time in 73 74 one book that caught my 203 00:09:36,290 --> 00:09:32,370 attention was called beyond Earth man's 204 00:09:41,720 --> 00:09:36,300 contact with UFOs and it was written by 205 00:09:45,860 --> 00:09:41,730 Ralph and Judy Blum and Ralph at the 206 00:09:51,139 --> 00:09:45,870 time in like 74 was doing some freelance 207 00:09:56,870 --> 00:09:51,149 work for for NBC he was helping NBC with 208 00:10:00,980 --> 00:09:56,880 a prime-time news special about UFOs and 209 00:10:04,250 --> 00:10:00,990 so he had an office over at NBC and he 210 00:10:07,300 --> 00:10:04,260 was his book as well as the show dealt 211 00:10:10,030 --> 00:10:07,310 with a lot of the people that had been 212 00:10:12,440 --> 00:10:10,040 involved with the UFOs like Donal Kehoe 213 00:10:14,720 --> 00:10:12,450 astronaut Gordon Cooper astronaut Jim 214 00:10:18,380 --> 00:10:14,730 McDivitt Allen Hynek Stan Friedman the 215 00:10:20,750 --> 00:10:18,390 nuclear physicist variety of really 216 00:10:24,019 --> 00:10:20,760 interesting people and and Larry coin 217 00:10:29,210 --> 00:10:24,029 the helicopter pilot and I loved the 218 00:10:31,370 --> 00:10:29,220 book because it gave me an idea that I I 219 00:10:32,870 --> 00:10:31,380 wanted to actually hear the voices of 220 00:10:35,569 --> 00:10:32,880 these people talking about what they 221 00:10:38,900 --> 00:10:35,579 knew what they saw what they suspected 222 00:10:42,500 --> 00:10:38,910 and and so I came up with this notion 223 00:10:45,920 --> 00:10:42,510 and I wanted to meet Ralph Blum the 224 00:10:49,840 --> 00:10:45,930 author of the book so knowing that he 225 00:10:52,760 --> 00:10:49,850 worked at NBC for the NBC News special 226 00:10:54,500 --> 00:10:52,770 one day I went over to 30 Rockefeller 227 00:10:56,150 --> 00:10:54,510 Plaza it was just down the street from 228 00:10:57,500 --> 00:10:56,160 the music store where I worked in New 229 00:10:59,810 --> 00:10:57,510 York 230 00:11:02,629 --> 00:10:59,820 and discover it very quickly even back 231 00:11:05,870 --> 00:11:02,639 then you can't just walk walk through 232 00:11:08,509 --> 00:11:05,880 the security desk at NBC and just walk 233 00:11:12,650 --> 00:11:08,519 in without any kind of a badge or ID or 234 00:11:14,870 --> 00:11:12,660 reason to be there so I went over to NBC 235 00:11:17,930 --> 00:11:14,880 and notice that there was a crowd of 236 00:11:21,019 --> 00:11:17,940 people standing around getting ready to 237 00:11:23,629 --> 00:11:21,029 go through the security desk on their 238 00:11:27,670 --> 00:11:23,639 way upstairs to watch a taping of 239 00:11:30,500 --> 00:11:27,680 Jeopardy because that's where jeopardy 240 00:11:32,420 --> 00:11:30,510 used to used to come out of this is back 241 00:11:33,949 --> 00:11:32,430 in the days before Alex Trebek was the 242 00:11:37,850 --> 00:11:33,959 hose back then it was a guy named art 243 00:11:40,850 --> 00:11:37,860 Flemming and the announcer the famous 244 00:11:44,629 --> 00:11:40,860 Don Pardo oh yeah ounce we just we just 245 00:11:47,030 --> 00:11:44,639 lost Don Pardo recently I just went into 246 00:11:49,699 --> 00:11:47,040 the crowd and became part of the crowd 247 00:11:51,829 --> 00:11:49,709 to go to the studio and I figured well 248 00:11:53,660 --> 00:11:51,839 while I'm in this nylon pass security 249 00:11:59,150 --> 00:11:53,670 and I'm in the building I'll go watch 250 00:12:00,740 --> 00:11:59,160 jeopardy for a few minutes I I did my 7 251 00:12:03,230 --> 00:12:00,750 the studio had a good time there and 252 00:12:05,059 --> 00:12:03,240 then when the show was over and it was 253 00:12:08,420 --> 00:12:05,069 time for the audience to leave the 254 00:12:09,710 --> 00:12:08,430 studio the tour guide was saying I 255 00:12:11,569 --> 00:12:09,720 everybody stayed together we're gonna 256 00:12:13,790 --> 00:12:11,579 follow us and we will show you how to 257 00:12:16,430 --> 00:12:13,800 get out of the building so as the crowd 258 00:12:19,430 --> 00:12:16,440 of Jeopardy audience went down one 259 00:12:21,800 --> 00:12:19,440 corridor at NBC I went down another car 260 00:12:25,220 --> 00:12:21,810 now I just I just walked away from the 261 00:12:30,309 --> 00:12:25,230 crowd and I started looking for Ralph 262 00:12:33,319 --> 00:12:30,319 Blum's office in the news area of NBC 263 00:12:35,780 --> 00:12:33,329 fine I finally found someone who said oh 264 00:12:37,910 --> 00:12:35,790 yes mr. bomb is zero down and that that 265 00:12:40,790 --> 00:12:37,920 office over there I went into to where 266 00:12:43,699 --> 00:12:40,800 his desk was and I didn't even know how 267 00:12:45,759 --> 00:12:43,709 would he look like I was kind of making 268 00:12:48,019 --> 00:12:45,769 it up as I was going along at this point 269 00:12:50,269 --> 00:12:48,029 what am I gonna say to him if I meet him 270 00:12:52,040 --> 00:12:50,279 how am I gonna figure this out so I 271 00:12:55,939 --> 00:12:52,050 walked into the office and someone said 272 00:13:01,970 --> 00:12:55,949 can we help you and I said yes I'm here 273 00:13:04,160 --> 00:13:01,980 to pick up Ralph Blum's mail I didn't 274 00:13:06,710 --> 00:13:04,170 know where that would get me possibly in 275 00:13:10,130 --> 00:13:06,720 jail I was taking a chance that he 276 00:13:11,300 --> 00:13:10,140 wasn't there and they didn't ask me any 277 00:13:13,580 --> 00:13:11,310 more questions they said 278 00:13:16,730 --> 00:13:13,590 hold on a minute we have we have a pile 279 00:13:19,190 --> 00:13:16,740 of it for him so they think they took 280 00:13:22,940 --> 00:13:19,200 they took his mail wraps it up put it in 281 00:13:23,480 --> 00:13:22,950 a bag and that of course gave me his 282 00:13:28,160 --> 00:13:23,490 address 283 00:13:29,540 --> 00:13:28,170 thank you and luckily for me I figured 284 00:13:32,420 --> 00:13:29,550 he must have lived in New York if he had 285 00:13:34,220 --> 00:13:32,430 an office at NBC so I went to the 286 00:13:37,970 --> 00:13:34,230 address on the Upper East Side of 287 00:13:41,350 --> 00:13:37,980 Manhattan and and I rung the bell for 288 00:13:44,000 --> 00:13:41,360 the blonds there was no answer and so I 289 00:13:47,240 --> 00:13:44,010 rang the bell for the super of the 290 00:13:50,240 --> 00:13:47,250 building and I said I'm here to leave a 291 00:13:52,040 --> 00:13:50,250 pile of mail for for the Blum's can I 292 00:13:53,900 --> 00:13:52,050 leave it with you to get it to them and 293 00:13:57,200 --> 00:13:53,910 he said sure I said all right well 294 00:13:58,960 --> 00:13:57,210 second I want to leave a note for for 295 00:14:01,160 --> 00:13:58,970 Ralph and I wrote a little note 296 00:14:04,160 --> 00:14:01,170 basically saying Oh mr. Bloem my name is 297 00:14:06,440 --> 00:14:04,170 Lee Spiegel I love your book I have an 298 00:14:08,890 --> 00:14:06,450 idea of a way that I can help you and 299 00:14:13,880 --> 00:14:08,900 you can help me it's great about UFOs 300 00:14:17,240 --> 00:14:13,890 hopefully you call me someday and a 301 00:14:19,190 --> 00:14:17,250 couple of days later my phone rings and 302 00:14:22,280 --> 00:14:19,200 this voice on the other end says is this 303 00:14:25,490 --> 00:14:22,290 Lee Spiegel and I said yes who is this 304 00:14:37,160 --> 00:14:25,500 and he said my name is Ralph Blum how 305 00:14:39,230 --> 00:14:37,170 the hell did you get my mail it was it 306 00:14:41,420 --> 00:14:39,240 was the best way I could figure to meet 307 00:14:47,900 --> 00:14:41,430 you so please don't be a friend that I 308 00:14:50,930 --> 00:14:47,910 apologize please just hear me out I said 309 00:14:53,380 --> 00:14:50,940 you know I've got this great idea taking 310 00:14:57,320 --> 00:14:53,390 the information that's in your book and 311 00:14:59,270 --> 00:14:57,330 turning it into a record album so that 312 00:15:02,960 --> 00:14:59,280 people could buy this record album and 313 00:15:06,110 --> 00:15:02,970 hear a documentary that has great voices 314 00:15:07,940 --> 00:15:06,120 of people talking about UFOs are you 315 00:15:18,199 --> 00:15:07,950 interested in talking to me about it and 316 00:15:20,990 --> 00:15:18,209 he said yes let's meet of course and 317 00:15:23,270 --> 00:15:21,000 when I told when I told my father this 318 00:15:25,199 --> 00:15:23,280 story well how I basically broke into 319 00:15:30,119 --> 00:15:25,209 NBC and my father 320 00:15:32,759 --> 00:15:30,129 said that's my stuff that is my son 321 00:15:34,530 --> 00:15:32,769 keep doing things like that yeah you'll 322 00:15:36,869 --> 00:15:34,540 go somewhere and that's yeah that is 323 00:15:39,840 --> 00:15:36,879 amazing amazing did you do that to get 324 00:15:42,540 --> 00:15:39,850 into the Huffington Post something 325 00:15:46,230 --> 00:15:42,550 similar oh no no actually you know all 326 00:15:49,530 --> 00:15:46,240 these years later I had been working as 327 00:15:51,139 --> 00:15:49,540 an editor a story editor over at 328 00:15:53,519 --> 00:15:51,149 abcnews.com 329 00:15:58,199 --> 00:15:53,529 and I was there for about five or six 330 00:16:03,059 --> 00:15:58,209 years and my friend buck wolf who was a 331 00:16:06,419 --> 00:16:03,069 writer for ABC News he left at one point 332 00:16:07,769 --> 00:16:06,429 and went over to work over at AOL and 333 00:16:08,549 --> 00:16:07,779 then this was this was about a year 334 00:16:13,410 --> 00:16:08,559 before 335 00:16:15,269 --> 00:16:13,420 AOL merged with Huffington Post and that 336 00:16:18,210 --> 00:16:15,279 was about four years ago and one day 337 00:16:20,939 --> 00:16:18,220 when when buck was over at AOL he called 338 00:16:23,040 --> 00:16:20,949 me and he said he said so how happy are 339 00:16:24,840 --> 00:16:23,050 you still being over at ABC News and I 340 00:16:27,359 --> 00:16:24,850 said I'm not very happy at all I can't 341 00:16:30,869 --> 00:16:27,369 write anything I'm just editing other 342 00:16:34,889 --> 00:16:30,879 people's stories and he said well listen 343 00:16:38,669 --> 00:16:34,899 I I have the need for someone to write 344 00:16:40,859 --> 00:16:38,679 UFO stories here over at AOL might you 345 00:16:41,910 --> 00:16:40,869 be interested in that and I said Hugh 346 00:16:45,869 --> 00:16:41,920 are you kidding 347 00:16:48,960 --> 00:16:45,879 yes I I'm already salivating over the 348 00:16:52,919 --> 00:16:48,970 idea and I I went over and he gave me 349 00:16:54,600 --> 00:16:52,929 the tour of very well and this was this 350 00:16:56,850 --> 00:16:54,610 was like as I said this was a year 351 00:16:59,639 --> 00:16:56,860 before Huffington Post was even involved 352 00:17:03,569 --> 00:16:59,649 with any of this and I spent the first 353 00:17:06,210 --> 00:17:03,579 year a freelancing writing stories for a 354 00:17:08,039 --> 00:17:06,220 AOL so I wasn't even really on staff yet 355 00:17:10,679 --> 00:17:08,049 I wasn't getting benefits or company 356 00:17:12,899 --> 00:17:10,689 perks or anything like that I wanted to 357 00:17:15,329 --> 00:17:12,909 do this so much that I didn't care about 358 00:17:17,610 --> 00:17:15,339 the perks thing I just wanted to be able 359 00:17:21,149 --> 00:17:17,620 to write and really start establishing 360 00:17:23,069 --> 00:17:21,159 myself as a serious writer and then the 361 00:17:25,319 --> 00:17:23,079 first year came and went and all of a 362 00:17:27,689 --> 00:17:25,329 sudden Huffington Post was on the scene 363 00:17:31,470 --> 00:17:27,699 and and they brought in a whole new 364 00:17:32,100 --> 00:17:31,480 staff of people and they they they made 365 00:17:35,159 --> 00:17:32,110 me an offer 366 00:17:38,460 --> 00:17:35,169 they kept buck and I and they said would 367 00:17:40,800 --> 00:17:38,470 you like to stay on with Huffington Post 368 00:17:42,570 --> 00:17:40,810 and become part of our staff and 369 00:17:47,160 --> 00:17:42,580 continue doing your UFO thing and I said 370 00:17:49,760 --> 00:17:47,170 yeah absolutely and Here I am I'm in my 371 00:17:52,470 --> 00:17:49,770 fifth year there now and I have written 372 00:17:55,290 --> 00:17:52,480 literally hundreds and hundreds and 373 00:17:57,750 --> 00:17:55,300 hundreds of stories which which still 374 00:17:59,930 --> 00:17:57,760 blows my mind that I thought yeah I'm 375 00:18:04,680 --> 00:17:59,940 knocking on wood everyday at My Luck 376 00:18:06,270 --> 00:18:04,690 tool and this kind of situation yeah now 377 00:18:09,120 --> 00:18:06,280 I didn't mean to cut you off about your 378 00:18:11,310 --> 00:18:09,130 album so if you want to go back to that 379 00:18:14,910 --> 00:18:11,320 and just say you know how that all 380 00:18:18,420 --> 00:18:14,920 worked out I saw that album online so I 381 00:18:20,370 --> 00:18:18,430 know it happened yeah it's like when 382 00:18:22,290 --> 00:18:20,380 Ralph Ralph Blum and I finally got 383 00:18:25,440 --> 00:18:22,300 together and we met and started becoming 384 00:18:28,050 --> 00:18:25,450 friends with some contacts that he had 385 00:18:31,290 --> 00:18:28,060 because his book was put out by Bantam 386 00:18:33,780 --> 00:18:31,300 Books and we took the idea of using his 387 00:18:36,780 --> 00:18:33,790 book as part of the pitch some friends 388 00:18:39,720 --> 00:18:36,790 that I had in the music industry news 389 00:18:43,320 --> 00:18:39,730 from people at CBS this was back in the 390 00:18:45,480 --> 00:18:43,330 day when when CBS had a division called 391 00:18:47,990 --> 00:18:45,490 Columbia House Records and they used to 392 00:18:51,660 --> 00:18:48,000 advertise in primetime television 393 00:18:54,810 --> 00:18:51,670 different record deals if yes right now 394 00:18:58,160 --> 00:18:54,820 for 895 will send you the complete works 395 00:19:01,920 --> 00:18:58,170 of Mantovani although all the classics 396 00:19:03,720 --> 00:19:01,930 just send in 895 and you know you will 397 00:19:08,190 --> 00:19:03,730 send you the album and this was back in 398 00:19:11,010 --> 00:19:08,200 the days of vinyl albums so nobody else 399 00:19:13,860 --> 00:19:11,020 was really doing this on TV this was the 400 00:19:15,480 --> 00:19:13,870 the early infomercials when they were 401 00:19:19,620 --> 00:19:15,490 selling products with like two minutes 402 00:19:22,410 --> 00:19:19,630 on TV so through the contacts of Ralph 403 00:19:25,770 --> 00:19:22,420 had and my friends had we got it we got 404 00:19:30,300 --> 00:19:25,780 an audience at CBS where we went in to 405 00:19:33,420 --> 00:19:30,310 do one pitch and the pitch was that with 406 00:19:34,170 --> 00:19:33,430 Ralph alums successful book and with my 407 00:19:38,580 --> 00:19:34,180 idea 408 00:19:42,000 --> 00:19:38,590 that I would take a really nice back 409 00:19:47,540 --> 00:19:42,010 then a cassette tape recorder and back 410 00:19:51,240 --> 00:19:47,550 in 1975 the smallest high-quality 411 00:19:51,990 --> 00:19:51,250 consent tape recorders was about 75 412 00:19:55,980 --> 00:19:52,000 pounds 413 00:19:57,750 --> 00:19:55,990 it was really a huge monster and it had 414 00:20:02,910 --> 00:19:57,760 this newfangled switch on it called 415 00:20:07,230 --> 00:20:02,920 Dobby that was the noise reduction of 416 00:20:09,210 --> 00:20:07,240 the day okay and and we basically we did 417 00:20:12,300 --> 00:20:09,220 a pitch to CBS and we said I would like 418 00:20:14,040 --> 00:20:12,310 to go around the country and with 419 00:20:16,470 --> 00:20:14,050 Ralph's help with the people that he 420 00:20:18,360 --> 00:20:16,480 already knows I will go from one place 421 00:20:22,650 --> 00:20:18,370 to another and I will interview 422 00:20:25,860 --> 00:20:22,660 astronauts scientists military people 423 00:20:28,740 --> 00:20:25,870 law enforcement people people who claim 424 00:20:31,710 --> 00:20:28,750 to have been abducted onto UFOs or put 425 00:20:35,340 --> 00:20:31,720 all together string it all together and 426 00:20:38,940 --> 00:20:35,350 get a really great narrator - to be the 427 00:20:42,180 --> 00:20:38,950 icing on the cake and would you be 428 00:20:45,120 --> 00:20:42,190 willing to do this and we can get Bantam 429 00:20:48,210 --> 00:20:45,130 Books involved where we can sell the 430 00:20:49,860 --> 00:20:48,220 album on TV and and let the audience 431 00:20:51,690 --> 00:20:49,870 know that if you're interested in buying 432 00:20:54,240 --> 00:20:51,700 this album you'll also get the bonus 433 00:20:56,970 --> 00:20:54,250 book beyond earth man's contact with 434 00:20:59,760 --> 00:20:56,980 UFOs if for some reason you don't like 435 00:21:02,160 --> 00:20:59,770 the album send it back but keep the book 436 00:21:05,430 --> 00:21:02,170 as our gift mm-hmm you know it was one 437 00:21:07,170 --> 00:21:05,440 of those kind of deals and and the CBS 438 00:21:12,750 --> 00:21:07,180 said okay we'll do it 439 00:21:15,450 --> 00:21:12,760 and I really let me do this they said 440 00:21:17,790 --> 00:21:15,460 well yes it sounds like a good idea so 441 00:21:21,420 --> 00:21:17,800 many pluses about this it had never been 442 00:21:24,330 --> 00:21:21,430 done before no UFO product and ever been 443 00:21:27,600 --> 00:21:24,340 sold on television like this before by a 444 00:21:31,410 --> 00:21:27,610 major company in a two minute television 445 00:21:34,070 --> 00:21:31,420 commercial it was unheard of and and and 446 00:21:36,960 --> 00:21:34,080 so there I was going around the country 447 00:21:39,510 --> 00:21:36,970 with this new heavy-duty 448 00:21:41,900 --> 00:21:39,520 cassette recorder and I found myself 449 00:21:44,250 --> 00:21:41,910 going from one town to another 450 00:21:47,910 --> 00:21:44,260 interviewing people like J Allen Hynek 451 00:21:51,210 --> 00:21:47,920 Stan Friedman Donnell Kehoe Gordon 452 00:21:54,270 --> 00:21:51,220 Cooper Jim McDivitt I mean and Betty 453 00:21:57,840 --> 00:21:54,280 here like I got to know Betty hill just 454 00:21:59,550 --> 00:21:57,850 an amazing experience for a guy like me 455 00:22:01,500 --> 00:21:59,560 who just came out of reading books about 456 00:22:03,990 --> 00:22:01,510 UFOs and now I was going around 457 00:22:10,020 --> 00:22:04,000 interviewing people for 458 00:22:13,740 --> 00:22:10,030 would you say oh I 1975 mm-hmm I was 459 00:22:17,810 --> 00:22:13,750 working on the album and the name of the 460 00:22:23,100 --> 00:22:17,820 album UFOs the credibility factor and 461 00:22:26,820 --> 00:22:23,110 just as a little aside that was 1975 462 00:22:31,080 --> 00:22:26,830 which means that in just a few months my 463 00:22:34,440 --> 00:22:31,090 album will be 40 years old coming up on 464 00:22:36,330 --> 00:22:34,450 the 40th anniversary of UFOs the 465 00:22:39,470 --> 00:22:36,340 credibility factor which is still 466 00:22:43,050 --> 00:22:39,480 relevant and I'm in the process now of 467 00:22:44,670 --> 00:22:43,060 working toward remarketing and reselling 468 00:22:47,640 --> 00:22:44,680 it to the public what is it 469 00:22:49,290 --> 00:22:47,650 yes Oh surely I'd really be excited to 470 00:22:52,020 --> 00:22:49,300 hear that and we'll put that on your 471 00:22:56,280 --> 00:22:52,030 website when you when that comes out for 472 00:23:01,410 --> 00:22:56,290 sure thank you so much now a little 473 00:23:04,800 --> 00:23:01,420 bonus story here so I'm I'm in 1975 in 474 00:23:06,420 --> 00:23:04,810 April working on my album trying to 475 00:23:08,430 --> 00:23:06,430 figure out well where am I gonna go next 476 00:23:12,750 --> 00:23:08,440 who do I have to interview and I get a 477 00:23:15,630 --> 00:23:12,760 call from astronomer J Allen Hynek and 478 00:23:17,900 --> 00:23:15,640 this point we started to become friends 479 00:23:21,450 --> 00:23:17,910 because I had already gone to Chicago 480 00:23:23,520 --> 00:23:21,460 interview him for the album and he had 481 00:23:28,110 --> 00:23:23,530 the Center for UFO studies that he had 482 00:23:31,470 --> 00:23:28,120 created after he left the Air Force what 483 00:23:35,610 --> 00:23:31,480 many people aren't aware of is that when 484 00:23:40,020 --> 00:23:35,620 the Air Force did its 20-year official 485 00:23:40,800 --> 00:23:40,030 UFO study known as Project Blue Book J 486 00:23:43,410 --> 00:23:40,810 Allen Hynek 487 00:23:46,440 --> 00:23:43,420 was the official scientific consultant 488 00:23:49,980 --> 00:23:46,450 to the Air Force for 20 years they used 489 00:23:52,590 --> 00:23:49,990 to send him all around the country to 490 00:23:56,250 --> 00:23:52,600 look into UFO reports with the with a 491 00:24:00,480 --> 00:23:56,260 specific objective to debunk and to 492 00:24:03,960 --> 00:24:00,490 explain UFOs away right that was his job 493 00:24:06,450 --> 00:24:03,970 with the Air Force so then when the Air 494 00:24:10,530 --> 00:24:06,460 Force closed Project Blue Book 495 00:24:13,380 --> 00:24:10,540 in 1969 Allen Hynek then went on to to 496 00:24:17,080 --> 00:24:13,390 create the Center for UFO studies just 497 00:24:21,640 --> 00:24:17,090 to continue serious UFO investigations 498 00:24:24,690 --> 00:24:21,650 so he calls me in April 1975 while I'm 499 00:24:26,860 --> 00:24:24,700 working on my album and he says listen 500 00:24:29,740 --> 00:24:26,870 the last couple of days I've been 501 00:24:32,800 --> 00:24:29,750 getting phone calls here in Chicago from 502 00:24:34,450 --> 00:24:32,810 sheriff's departments highway patrolmen 503 00:24:37,480 --> 00:24:34,460 police departments 504 00:24:40,750 --> 00:24:37,490 they've all been seeing a strange object 505 00:24:41,590 --> 00:24:40,760 in the sky at night they don't know how 506 00:24:43,480 --> 00:24:41,600 to explain it 507 00:24:46,810 --> 00:24:43,490 they're a little concerned about it and 508 00:24:49,030 --> 00:24:46,820 they all have my hotline number where 509 00:24:51,220 --> 00:24:49,040 law enforcement agencies can call me 510 00:24:53,350 --> 00:24:51,230 here at the Center for UFO studies so 511 00:24:56,980 --> 00:24:53,360 they called me and they've asked me to 512 00:24:58,630 --> 00:24:56,990 help them and and he said to me I don't 513 00:25:01,000 --> 00:24:58,640 have an investigator down there in North 514 00:25:03,850 --> 00:25:01,010 Carolina would you go down there and 515 00:25:06,190 --> 00:25:03,860 check it out for me and do some 516 00:25:08,640 --> 00:25:06,200 interviews with some of the officers and 517 00:25:12,430 --> 00:25:08,650 if you think that there's some credible 518 00:25:14,320 --> 00:25:12,440 sightings and reports you can file a 519 00:25:18,070 --> 00:25:14,330 report and I'll publish your findings 520 00:25:21,430 --> 00:25:18,080 through the Center for UFO studies and I 521 00:25:23,200 --> 00:25:21,440 said to him well what is it that they're 522 00:25:26,470 --> 00:25:23,210 reporting what are they calling you 523 00:25:29,530 --> 00:25:26,480 about he says well this is something new 524 00:25:31,450 --> 00:25:29,540 we haven't heard a lot about this but 525 00:25:34,030 --> 00:25:31,460 they're seeing a triangular shaped 526 00:25:35,860 --> 00:25:34,040 object to the sky and I went really 527 00:25:38,140 --> 00:25:35,870 triangles we know we really haven't 528 00:25:41,440 --> 00:25:38,150 heard much about that again remember 529 00:25:42,940 --> 00:25:41,450 that was 1975 lately these days that's 530 00:25:43,900 --> 00:25:42,950 all you hear about are triangles that's 531 00:25:46,540 --> 00:25:43,910 right mm-hmm 532 00:25:50,380 --> 00:25:46,550 okay so but this was one of the first it 533 00:25:52,540 --> 00:25:50,390 turns out I said so so it's a triangular 534 00:25:54,700 --> 00:25:52,550 shaped object and they're still seeing 535 00:25:56,980 --> 00:25:54,710 it so are you are you saying to me 536 00:26:00,430 --> 00:25:56,990 dr. Hynek you want me to go down to 537 00:26:04,600 --> 00:26:00,440 North Carolina and investigate flying 538 00:26:05,980 --> 00:26:04,610 dorritos because that's what it sounds 539 00:26:08,020 --> 00:26:05,990 like he said well yes I guess that's 540 00:26:10,420 --> 00:26:08,030 what I'm asking you to do I said really 541 00:26:13,540 --> 00:26:10,430 can't you send me someplace where I can 542 00:26:16,570 --> 00:26:13,550 actually see a classic flying saucer I 543 00:26:18,940 --> 00:26:16,580 didn't really like to see that he said 544 00:26:21,910 --> 00:26:18,950 look if you don't want to go I'll find 545 00:26:23,980 --> 00:26:21,920 someone else no no no no no are you 546 00:26:26,950 --> 00:26:23,990 kidding I'm gonna turn down a request 547 00:26:28,390 --> 00:26:26,960 from Gervais Allen Hynek to Google to go 548 00:26:30,320 --> 00:26:28,400 basically you're making an appointment 549 00:26:36,519 --> 00:26:30,330 for me to see this thing I'm going 550 00:26:40,509 --> 00:26:36,529 I'm going and I went and got down to 551 00:26:42,919 --> 00:26:40,519 North Carolina flew into Fayetteville 552 00:26:44,330 --> 00:26:42,929 and then someone from the Sheriff's 553 00:26:46,820 --> 00:26:44,340 Department came and picked me up and 554 00:26:49,159 --> 00:26:46,830 drove me down to Lumberton and within a 555 00:26:51,230 --> 00:26:49,169 few hours of my arrival I was in the 556 00:26:57,019 --> 00:26:51,240 sheriff's office the calls started 557 00:27:00,409 --> 00:26:57,029 coming in yeah like like clockwork 558 00:27:02,389 --> 00:27:00,419 and a new newspaper accounts I can you 559 00:27:03,950 --> 00:27:02,399 can even send you these things I have 560 00:27:06,110 --> 00:27:03,960 the I have all the original newspaper 561 00:27:08,840 --> 00:27:06,120 accounts that said you know dr. J Allen 562 00:27:11,180 --> 00:27:08,850 Hynek in Chicago sending a New York City 563 00:27:17,029 --> 00:27:11,190 UFO investigator here to explain all 564 00:27:20,539 --> 00:27:17,039 this away and so I was there and I got 565 00:27:23,570 --> 00:27:20,549 into one of the sheriff's cars officer 566 00:27:26,500 --> 00:27:23,580 and we went and we kept in contact with 567 00:27:29,120 --> 00:27:26,510 other law enforcement officers in cars 568 00:27:32,180 --> 00:27:29,130 through the car radios and a few minutes 569 00:27:35,299 --> 00:27:32,190 later we all converged in front of this 570 00:27:36,169 --> 00:27:35,309 big field and everybody get everybody 571 00:27:40,009 --> 00:27:36,179 get out of the cars 572 00:27:43,549 --> 00:27:40,019 turn the car engines off it was already 573 00:27:46,269 --> 00:27:43,559 dark lots of stars no moon just stars 574 00:27:49,850 --> 00:27:46,279 and the only sound that we could hear 575 00:27:52,190 --> 00:27:49,860 the sound of animals nervous animals in 576 00:27:55,310 --> 00:27:52,200 the area there was because they knew 577 00:27:59,419 --> 00:27:55,320 something was up and as we looked across 578 00:28:03,889 --> 00:27:59,429 the field from our left moving toward 579 00:28:06,080 --> 00:28:03,899 the right just above a line of trees was 580 00:28:08,750 --> 00:28:06,090 a red light and then a white light it 581 00:28:12,200 --> 00:28:08,760 was alternating red white red white 582 00:28:14,600 --> 00:28:12,210 moving just very slowly moving along 583 00:28:16,250 --> 00:28:14,610 above the trees and then when it got to 584 00:28:19,430 --> 00:28:16,260 the point where it was right directly 585 00:28:22,639 --> 00:28:19,440 across the field from us it stopped 586 00:28:25,639 --> 00:28:22,649 moving and then it changed its direction 587 00:28:27,769 --> 00:28:25,649 and started moving directly across the 588 00:28:33,379 --> 00:28:27,779 field toward where we were standing 589 00:28:37,100 --> 00:28:33,389 oh yeah yeah oh is right like there were 590 00:28:41,180 --> 00:28:37,110 other expletives that I used oh yeah 591 00:28:42,430 --> 00:28:41,190 yeah Oh in a few other words and it came 592 00:28:45,279 --> 00:28:42,440 across 593 00:28:49,000 --> 00:28:45,289 filled very slowly very deliberately no 594 00:28:52,000 --> 00:28:49,010 sound until it stopped and parked itself 595 00:28:53,980 --> 00:28:52,010 right in the sky above us and it was at 596 00:28:56,850 --> 00:28:53,990 that point that we could clearly see 597 00:28:59,740 --> 00:28:56,860 that it was the shape of a triangle 598 00:29:02,409 --> 00:28:59,750 because it had it had a row of white 599 00:29:04,409 --> 00:29:02,419 lights up one side of it and a row of 600 00:29:07,360 --> 00:29:04,419 red lights up the other side of it and 601 00:29:09,610 --> 00:29:07,370 at the apex where these two sides 602 00:29:12,490 --> 00:29:09,620 actually met there was a bigger brighter 603 00:29:15,730 --> 00:29:12,500 light what you know they hear that a lot 604 00:29:18,190 --> 00:29:15,740 yeah so this thing literally was just 605 00:29:20,610 --> 00:29:18,200 hovering there I like I said it had no 606 00:29:23,740 --> 00:29:20,620 engine there was no sound whatsoever 607 00:29:25,510 --> 00:29:23,750 would you guess sighs I'm sorry 608 00:29:27,789 --> 00:29:25,520 would you guess yeah eyes are this thing 609 00:29:29,649 --> 00:29:27,799 at the height of it someone thought that 610 00:29:32,130 --> 00:29:29,659 it was maybe a couple hundred yards in 611 00:29:34,360 --> 00:29:32,140 the sky above us and and it was then 612 00:29:36,460 --> 00:29:34,370 determined by one of the officers that 613 00:29:38,710 --> 00:29:36,470 it didn't look like it was much bigger 614 00:29:41,169 --> 00:29:38,720 than if you put a couple of the the 615 00:29:44,320 --> 00:29:41,179 police cars together so it wasn't a 616 00:29:46,299 --> 00:29:44,330 gigantic ship horseman or object but it 617 00:29:49,960 --> 00:29:46,309 was still just sitting there in the sky 618 00:29:53,590 --> 00:29:49,970 not doing anything and and I remember 619 00:29:56,320 --> 00:29:53,600 thinking that I felt really pretty safe 620 00:29:58,180 --> 00:29:56,330 and confident because I'm surrounded by 621 00:30:01,090 --> 00:29:58,190 police officers and they bet they're six 622 00:30:02,860 --> 00:30:01,100 shooters ready to go into action and 623 00:30:03,370 --> 00:30:02,870 then I caught myself when I went wait a 624 00:30:08,200 --> 00:30:03,380 minute 625 00:30:12,760 --> 00:30:08,210 really how safe do I feel if this thing 626 00:30:14,169 --> 00:30:12,770 is here to eat us do you think some six 627 00:30:18,070 --> 00:30:14,179 shooters are gonna do any good 628 00:30:20,080 --> 00:30:18,080 no so all of these thoughts you know 629 00:30:23,230 --> 00:30:20,090 we're probably also going on in their 630 00:30:25,090 --> 00:30:23,240 minds too and as we watched it out of 631 00:30:28,419 --> 00:30:25,100 the the the the brought the brighter 632 00:30:30,789 --> 00:30:28,429 light on the object a beam of light came 633 00:30:33,730 --> 00:30:30,799 down from the object and surrounded us 634 00:30:35,830 --> 00:30:33,740 where we were standing she just came 635 00:30:37,899 --> 00:30:35,840 right out of it came right down and it 636 00:30:40,419 --> 00:30:37,909 was so bright it was like a magnesium 637 00:30:41,919 --> 00:30:40,429 flare the you often see at construction 638 00:30:42,310 --> 00:30:41,929 sites where you can't really look right 639 00:30:44,560 --> 00:30:42,320 at it 640 00:30:48,460 --> 00:30:44,570 mmm it was that kind of kind of blinding 641 00:30:50,380 --> 00:30:48,470 light it must have lasted maybe two 642 00:30:52,180 --> 00:30:50,390 three seconds at the most and then the 643 00:30:55,000 --> 00:30:52,190 light went right back into the craft and 644 00:30:55,870 --> 00:30:55,010 then the whole thing all the lights on 645 00:30:59,110 --> 00:30:55,880 the craft 646 00:31:02,919 --> 00:30:59,120 turned off and the entire object became 647 00:31:07,090 --> 00:31:02,929 like an amber color Wow and and it very 648 00:31:09,070 --> 00:31:07,100 slowly did about a 45 degree turn and 649 00:31:12,430 --> 00:31:09,080 then then slowly started moving off in 650 00:31:14,409 --> 00:31:12,440 another direction as if to say I'm done 651 00:31:18,159 --> 00:31:14,419 with you guys I'm going somewhere else 652 00:31:19,840 --> 00:31:18,169 now okay and that's what it did and we 653 00:31:21,700 --> 00:31:19,850 we get into the cars and we started 654 00:31:23,919 --> 00:31:21,710 tracking it and following it through a 655 00:31:26,590 --> 00:31:23,929 couple of different counties and and 656 00:31:30,100 --> 00:31:26,600 every place we stopped we found other 657 00:31:31,390 --> 00:31:30,110 police officials who had just had their 658 00:31:36,220 --> 00:31:31,400 own encounter with it 659 00:31:38,560 --> 00:31:36,230 I stopped at one place spoke to police 660 00:31:41,409 --> 00:31:38,570 officer a police chief I'm sorry it was 661 00:31:44,260 --> 00:31:41,419 police chief Gary Moore who had been 662 00:31:45,970 --> 00:31:44,270 sitting in his car near a lake and he 663 00:31:49,630 --> 00:31:45,980 said that while he was sitting there the 664 00:31:51,610 --> 00:31:49,640 whole inside of his car just lit up she 665 00:31:55,260 --> 00:31:51,620 isn't that familiar like what happened 666 00:31:58,240 --> 00:31:55,270 with the helicopter pilot hmm from 1973 667 00:32:02,380 --> 00:31:58,250 and I said well what did you do he said 668 00:32:04,779 --> 00:32:02,390 I just kind of leaned out the car window 669 00:32:06,460 --> 00:32:04,789 and looked up very reminiscent of 670 00:32:10,299 --> 00:32:06,470 Richard Dreyfuss and Close Encounters of 671 00:32:12,370 --> 00:32:10,309 the Third Kind okay but this was this 672 00:32:17,490 --> 00:32:12,380 was three years before that movie came 673 00:32:20,649 --> 00:32:17,500 out actually two years before the movie 674 00:32:23,380 --> 00:32:20,659 he looked up and he saw this thing just 675 00:32:26,529 --> 00:32:23,390 sitting in the sky above him he got out 676 00:32:28,680 --> 00:32:26,539 of his car went to his trunk and he 677 00:32:31,000 --> 00:32:28,690 pulled out one of those big old 678 00:32:33,970 --> 00:32:31,010 law-enforcement lanterns that they use 679 00:32:36,970 --> 00:32:33,980 for emergencies he he pointed the 680 00:32:40,149 --> 00:32:36,980 lantern up to the object and he NE 681 00:32:42,580 --> 00:32:40,159 blinked the light and he said to light 682 00:32:45,010 --> 00:32:42,590 the object blinked back at him once 683 00:32:47,950 --> 00:32:45,020 before you hear that I said so what else 684 00:32:52,360 --> 00:32:47,960 did you do he said well I blinked twice 685 00:32:54,640 --> 00:32:52,370 and it blinked twice back at me again 686 00:32:56,080 --> 00:32:54,650 again you know it's two years later you 687 00:32:58,000 --> 00:32:56,090 think about the mother ship that comes 688 00:33:00,070 --> 00:32:58,010 down and Close Encounters and they have 689 00:33:01,539 --> 00:33:00,080 that whole communication at the end 690 00:33:03,279 --> 00:33:01,549 between the mother ship and the music 691 00:33:06,730 --> 00:33:03,289 yeah have you ever heard of the father 692 00:33:07,750 --> 00:33:06,740 Gill sighting oh yeah Papua New Guinea 693 00:33:09,399 --> 00:33:07,760 that's right 694 00:33:11,129 --> 00:33:09,409 their interaction there there was a 695 00:33:15,789 --> 00:33:11,139 number of times you hear there's 696 00:33:18,159 --> 00:33:15,799 interaction which is amazing it is 697 00:33:20,769 --> 00:33:18,169 amazing it was a great encounter I wrote 698 00:33:24,129 --> 00:33:20,779 I've got a lot of great interviews sent 699 00:33:26,200 --> 00:33:24,139 the report back to Allen Hynek I called 700 00:33:28,600 --> 00:33:26,210 I think was Pope Air Force Base outside 701 00:33:30,340 --> 00:33:28,610 of Fayetteville just to see if they'd 702 00:33:32,769 --> 00:33:30,350 had anything in the sky that night and 703 00:33:36,159 --> 00:33:32,779 of course they said no put all the 704 00:33:38,860 --> 00:33:36,169 pieces together and and it was 705 00:33:41,139 --> 00:33:38,870 eventually it was it was written up and 706 00:33:43,899 --> 00:33:41,149 and it was published by the Center for 707 00:33:45,940 --> 00:33:43,909 UFO studies so so there's my personal 708 00:33:47,590 --> 00:33:45,950 close encounter you know it's the kind 709 00:33:50,320 --> 00:33:47,600 of thing where you never forget it after 710 00:33:54,610 --> 00:33:50,330 it happens it's so dramatic mm-hmm and 711 00:33:56,320 --> 00:33:54,620 they didn't come to eat me it seems like 712 00:33:58,120 --> 00:33:56,330 you were already really into the topic 713 00:34:01,690 --> 00:33:58,130 before you even showed up there but did 714 00:34:06,669 --> 00:34:01,700 it change anything in your life no it 715 00:34:08,680 --> 00:34:06,679 just made me more more aggressive about 716 00:34:12,309 --> 00:34:08,690 wanting to find out what this stuff was 717 00:34:15,399 --> 00:34:12,319 about and this was also at a point where 718 00:34:18,579 --> 00:34:15,409 my attitude was and and mostly because 719 00:34:20,619 --> 00:34:18,589 of things that Stanton Friedman the 720 00:34:21,280 --> 00:34:20,629 nuclear physicists had said to me ever 721 00:34:25,030 --> 00:34:21,290 since 722 00:34:27,730 --> 00:34:25,040 in 1975 74 there abouts right to this 723 00:34:31,180 --> 00:34:27,740 very day all these years later Stan 724 00:34:33,250 --> 00:34:31,190 Friedman is still consistently saying do 725 00:34:37,270 --> 00:34:33,260 two groups and lecturers that he goes to 726 00:34:40,809 --> 00:34:37,280 he definitely believes that some UFOs 727 00:34:44,430 --> 00:34:40,819 are somebody else's extraterrestrial 728 00:34:48,159 --> 00:34:44,440 intelligently controlled spacecraft and 729 00:34:51,339 --> 00:34:48,169 and and he he doesn't waver from that at 730 00:34:55,750 --> 00:34:51,349 all and and so for the longest time I 731 00:34:57,730 --> 00:34:55,760 was believing that too even though so 732 00:34:59,800 --> 00:34:57,740 many scientists mainstream scientists 733 00:35:02,559 --> 00:34:59,810 will say well well that that can't be 734 00:35:06,250 --> 00:35:02,569 true nobody's visiting us there's no 735 00:35:08,680 --> 00:35:06,260 evidence they can't possibly get here 736 00:35:10,930 --> 00:35:08,690 from wherever they might be coming from 737 00:35:15,630 --> 00:35:10,940 the distance is a too great 738 00:35:19,089 --> 00:35:15,640 blah blah blah I say to them you know 739 00:35:20,740 --> 00:35:19,099 even even in the book the novel and then 740 00:35:23,920 --> 00:35:20,750 the movie contact it was 741 00:35:27,010 --> 00:35:23,930 by Carl Sagan even a conservative guy 742 00:35:30,240 --> 00:35:27,020 like Sagan was was speculating on the 743 00:35:34,300 --> 00:35:30,250 possibility that you know if if you take 744 00:35:36,910 --> 00:35:34,310 any civilization that might be oh let's 745 00:35:40,020 --> 00:35:36,920 conservatively say five hundred years 746 00:35:42,760 --> 00:35:40,030 ahead of us a thousand years ahead of us 747 00:35:45,610 --> 00:35:42,770 technologically don't you think it's 748 00:35:48,040 --> 00:35:45,620 possible that they have figured out how 749 00:35:50,440 --> 00:35:48,050 to how to leapfrog over the great 750 00:35:53,440 --> 00:35:50,450 distances that everybody else is saying 751 00:35:56,470 --> 00:35:53,450 it can't be done mm-hmm Stan Friedman 752 00:35:58,210 --> 00:35:56,480 always loves to say in his lectures and 753 00:36:01,510 --> 00:35:58,220 I'm always repeating this and he's so 754 00:36:04,480 --> 00:36:01,520 right he says when somebody says that 755 00:36:07,180 --> 00:36:04,490 that bit of UFO behavior is impossible 756 00:36:09,550 --> 00:36:07,190 what they're really saying is I don't 757 00:36:10,810 --> 00:36:09,560 know how to do that and and if I don't 758 00:36:13,690 --> 00:36:10,820 know how to do it well then it must be 759 00:36:16,690 --> 00:36:13,700 impossible yeah there's there's the 760 00:36:20,590 --> 00:36:16,700 attitude right there it's like it's the 761 00:36:24,460 --> 00:36:20,600 same attitude as she once not that long 762 00:36:26,920 --> 00:36:24,470 ago in our history once the earth was 763 00:36:30,790 --> 00:36:26,930 the center of the universe and everybody 764 00:36:34,870 --> 00:36:30,800 believed it mm-hmm so you know science 765 00:36:38,860 --> 00:36:34,880 over a period of time we learn through 766 00:36:41,920 --> 00:36:38,870 doing that things change concepts change 767 00:36:43,990 --> 00:36:41,930 beliefs change that what we think is 768 00:36:46,360 --> 00:36:44,000 impossible now we know it's probably 769 00:36:50,380 --> 00:36:46,370 going to change and become the possible 770 00:36:53,490 --> 00:36:50,390 and and and and many scientists are now 771 00:36:57,180 --> 00:36:53,500 coming around to that idea especially 772 00:36:59,950 --> 00:36:57,190 physicists who are talking about other 773 00:37:02,800 --> 00:36:59,960 dimensional realities around us where 774 00:37:04,960 --> 00:37:02,810 some of these some of these UFOs might 775 00:37:08,470 --> 00:37:04,970 not be coming from very far away they 776 00:37:11,050 --> 00:37:08,480 could be coming from very close by there 777 00:37:14,170 --> 00:37:11,060 are so many stories where where 778 00:37:16,330 --> 00:37:14,180 eyewitnesses report a UFO just suddenly 779 00:37:17,950 --> 00:37:16,340 appeared out of nowhere and it aids away 780 00:37:21,250 --> 00:37:17,960 yeah then fades away 781 00:37:23,740 --> 00:37:21,260 I don't know into into nowhere well what 782 00:37:25,960 --> 00:37:23,750 what is the technology what is that it 783 00:37:28,960 --> 00:37:25,970 well it sounds like if you keep it 784 00:37:32,620 --> 00:37:28,970 simple someone knows how to slip into 785 00:37:33,309 --> 00:37:32,630 and out of other spaces what why should 786 00:37:36,880 --> 00:37:33,319 we have 787 00:37:40,739 --> 00:37:36,890 believing that there are too many 788 00:37:44,109 --> 00:37:40,749 possibilities out there even a very 789 00:37:48,160 --> 00:37:44,119 conservative astronomer like seth 790 00:37:49,059 --> 00:37:48,170 shostack he's the senior oh yeah at the 791 00:37:51,249 --> 00:37:49,069 SETI Institute 792 00:37:55,029 --> 00:37:51,259 he's been on a couple of times okay yes 793 00:37:57,839 --> 00:37:55,039 Seth just a couple of weeks ago was one 794 00:38:02,979 --> 00:37:57,849 of the main speakers at the NASA 795 00:38:05,259 --> 00:38:02,989 Astrobiology symposium at the Library of 796 00:38:07,680 --> 00:38:05,269 Congress and there were many people 797 00:38:11,890 --> 00:38:07,690 invited to speak there including 798 00:38:14,410 --> 00:38:11,900 astronomers from the Vatican and among 799 00:38:18,039 --> 00:38:14,420 the things that Seth said were some 800 00:38:21,539 --> 00:38:18,049 staggering numbers and we we know these 801 00:38:26,049 --> 00:38:21,549 numbers now to be pretty close to fact 802 00:38:28,680 --> 00:38:26,059 mostly from too little wonderful devices 803 00:38:30,640 --> 00:38:28,690 one called the Hubble Space Telescope 804 00:38:34,299 --> 00:38:30,650 the other one called 805 00:38:36,039 --> 00:38:34,309 the Kepler spacecraft I like to refer to 806 00:38:43,089 --> 00:38:36,049 Kepler as the little spacecraft that 807 00:38:46,359 --> 00:38:43,099 could has already discovered which have 808 00:38:52,120 --> 00:38:46,369 now been confirmed more than 1,400 new 809 00:38:54,849 --> 00:38:52,130 planets and Hubble has earlier this year 810 00:38:59,559 --> 00:38:54,859 I'm not sure if you saw this but but 811 00:39:02,890 --> 00:38:59,569 nASA released an image that NASA says is 812 00:39:05,650 --> 00:39:02,900 probably the greatest most incredible 813 00:39:08,620 --> 00:39:05,660 image that Hubble has ever taken is a 814 00:39:13,779 --> 00:39:08,630 deep-space one it's the deep space that 815 00:39:18,279 --> 00:39:13,789 shows 10,000 galaxies right in just this 816 00:39:22,359 --> 00:39:18,289 one little moment in space and based on 817 00:39:24,459 --> 00:39:22,369 those kinds of numbers now astronomers 818 00:39:27,579 --> 00:39:24,469 are saying and here are the numbers that 819 00:39:30,370 --> 00:39:27,589 Seth Shostak was throwing out to the 820 00:39:34,390 --> 00:39:30,380 people in Washington now he says now we 821 00:39:37,479 --> 00:39:34,400 know we're pretty sure there are 822 00:39:40,630 --> 00:39:37,489 billions of galaxies that we think there 823 00:39:42,339 --> 00:39:40,640 might be as many as a hundred billion 824 00:39:50,890 --> 00:39:42,349 galaxies 825 00:39:54,880 --> 00:39:50,900 hundreds of billions of stars or Suns 826 00:39:58,719 --> 00:39:54,890 and we now believe that many if not most 827 00:40:02,349 --> 00:39:58,729 of those Suns have planets around them 828 00:40:05,529 --> 00:40:02,359 and so in bringing it and bringing it 829 00:40:09,699 --> 00:40:05,539 down to our galaxy he says so let's just 830 00:40:11,829 --> 00:40:09,709 consider the numbers in our galaxy the 831 00:40:13,900 --> 00:40:11,839 little Milky Way galaxy that has maybe a 832 00:40:17,890 --> 00:40:13,910 hundred billion stars we can 833 00:40:20,380 --> 00:40:17,900 conservatively estimate he says with all 834 00:40:23,199 --> 00:40:20,390 those numbers and all the possible 835 00:40:27,390 --> 00:40:23,209 planets out there that there could be in 836 00:40:31,299 --> 00:40:27,400 the Milky Way galaxy as many as 50 837 00:40:35,859 --> 00:40:31,309 billion habitable planets and that 838 00:40:39,130 --> 00:40:35,869 amazing Wow that's people it's it's so 839 00:40:42,579 --> 00:40:39,140 difficult for us to understand the 840 00:40:44,709 --> 00:40:42,589 number exactly how do how do we how do 841 00:40:47,799 --> 00:40:44,719 we absorb that what do we do with that 842 00:40:50,339 --> 00:40:47,809 information and leave it to the Vatican 843 00:40:53,679 --> 00:40:50,349 Vatican astronomers are now saying that 844 00:40:56,949 --> 00:40:53,689 if it turns out that we do have brothers 845 00:40:57,459 --> 00:40:56,959 and sisters out there we have no problem 846 00:40:59,799 --> 00:40:57,469 with that 847 00:41:03,039 --> 00:40:59,809 right good because to us it just proves 848 00:41:05,559 --> 00:41:03,049 that God has a bigger Dominion with life 849 00:41:08,709 --> 00:41:05,569 flourishes don't you love it one of the 850 00:41:11,289 --> 00:41:08,719 fathers here from the Vatican yes said a 851 00:41:14,699 --> 00:41:11,299 couple of pretty interesting things at 852 00:41:18,339 --> 00:41:14,709 this meeting can you touch it 853 00:41:20,229 --> 00:41:18,349 Jesuit brother guy Consolmagno and he 854 00:41:22,959 --> 00:41:20,239 first he first started this ball rolling 855 00:41:26,919 --> 00:41:22,969 even a few years ago where he just came 856 00:41:28,779 --> 00:41:26,929 out and said look we have no problem 857 00:41:31,299 --> 00:41:28,789 with their being brothers and sisters 858 00:41:34,079 --> 00:41:31,309 from the Stars and in fact we would be 859 00:41:36,130 --> 00:41:34,089 happy to baptize that's right any any 860 00:41:41,289 --> 00:41:36,140 extraterrestrials but they'd have to ask 861 00:41:45,189 --> 00:41:41,299 us first and to take it a step further 862 00:41:47,890 --> 00:41:45,199 Martin just a few months ago and this 863 00:41:48,669 --> 00:41:47,900 everybody was went crazy about this this 864 00:41:53,009 --> 00:41:48,679 went viral 865 00:41:55,140 --> 00:41:53,019 instantly during one of Pope Francis's 866 00:41:59,670 --> 00:41:55,150 Monday morning 867 00:42:01,650 --> 00:41:59,680 services at the Vatican he said and 868 00:42:05,220 --> 00:42:01,660 nobody asked him to say this he just 869 00:42:07,830 --> 00:42:05,230 blurted this out he said you know if we 870 00:42:11,630 --> 00:42:07,840 were to be visited tomorrow by Martians 871 00:42:14,190 --> 00:42:11,640 and he actually used the word Martians 872 00:42:16,260 --> 00:42:14,200 he didn't say ETS or aliens or 873 00:42:19,020 --> 00:42:16,270 extraterrestrial he was he was focusing 874 00:42:23,040 --> 00:42:19,030 right in on Mars okay he said if 875 00:42:26,430 --> 00:42:23,050 Martians were to come here and were to 876 00:42:29,340 --> 00:42:26,440 ask us to baptize them he said Who am I 877 00:42:31,860 --> 00:42:29,350 to refuse them well like Wow 878 00:42:34,530 --> 00:42:31,870 are you kidding and I say to people in 879 00:42:39,530 --> 00:42:34,540 in lectures that I do in presentations I 880 00:42:44,270 --> 00:42:39,540 say to people do you folks even know 881 00:42:47,820 --> 00:42:44,280 that the Vatican has not won a to 882 00:42:50,550 --> 00:42:47,830 astronomical observatory what one in 883 00:42:53,760 --> 00:42:50,560 Italy and one on a mountain peak in 884 00:42:57,000 --> 00:42:53,770 Arizona and they have Jesuit brothers 885 00:42:59,910 --> 00:42:57,010 who are astronomers and so the question 886 00:43:02,850 --> 00:42:59,920 that I like to raise is what are they 887 00:43:04,980 --> 00:43:02,860 looking for right you know you know 888 00:43:07,440 --> 00:43:04,990 there was a claim I heard I don't know 889 00:43:09,680 --> 00:43:07,450 if it was on coast to coast or somewhere 890 00:43:12,840 --> 00:43:09,690 where they were saying that out of those 891 00:43:18,720 --> 00:43:12,850 observatories they actually saw signs of 892 00:43:19,610 --> 00:43:18,730 life did you ever hear of anything like 893 00:43:23,100 --> 00:43:19,620 that 894 00:43:26,720 --> 00:43:23,110 like I know like brother guy his main 895 00:43:31,020 --> 00:43:26,730 area of expertise is studying meteorites 896 00:43:32,460 --> 00:43:31,030 and because they're very interesting 897 00:43:35,220 --> 00:43:32,470 this is very interested in asteroids 898 00:43:37,050 --> 00:43:35,230 because they they want to know they're 899 00:43:39,600 --> 00:43:37,060 concerned that some asteroids become 900 00:43:42,390 --> 00:43:39,610 they're getting too close to Earth and 901 00:43:44,550 --> 00:43:42,400 so far as far as we know we haven't been 902 00:43:47,820 --> 00:43:44,560 told but it doesn't it does not appear 903 00:43:49,980 --> 00:43:47,830 as if Earth has any real defense against 904 00:43:52,770 --> 00:43:49,990 an incoming asteroid hmm 905 00:43:57,390 --> 00:43:52,780 I mean there are things out there that 906 00:44:00,720 --> 00:43:57,400 we as earthlings should be banding 907 00:44:02,460 --> 00:44:00,730 together to take care of each other but 908 00:44:04,590 --> 00:44:02,470 we're not doing that you know and it 909 00:44:07,210 --> 00:44:04,600 seems like whatever the amount of money 910 00:44:09,280 --> 00:44:07,220 that would be spent to protect 911 00:44:11,830 --> 00:44:09,290 from something like that would be well 912 00:44:15,550 --> 00:44:11,840 worth it but there's no money of course 913 00:44:18,490 --> 00:44:15,560 you're absolutely right you know all the 914 00:44:22,120 --> 00:44:18,500 money that's spent on new stealth bomber 915 00:44:24,130 --> 00:44:22,130 technology you know so we can have we 916 00:44:26,800 --> 00:44:24,140 can have the upper hand on all other 917 00:44:30,430 --> 00:44:26,810 military organizations really folks 918 00:44:32,980 --> 00:44:30,440 really are we still the kind of 919 00:44:35,589 --> 00:44:32,990 planetary species that is concerned 920 00:44:37,570 --> 00:44:35,599 about this and people wonder people say 921 00:44:39,339 --> 00:44:37,580 well why don't the why not the aliens or 922 00:44:41,130 --> 00:44:39,349 whoever they are and where they come 923 00:44:43,690 --> 00:44:41,140 from why don't they just show themselves 924 00:44:46,120 --> 00:44:43,700 and and say you know here we are let's 925 00:44:49,120 --> 00:44:46,130 all be one big happy family 926 00:44:50,950 --> 00:44:49,130 are you kidding with all the radio 927 00:44:53,170 --> 00:44:50,960 signals going out with all the 928 00:44:55,330 --> 00:44:53,180 television signals with all the rockets 929 00:44:58,450 --> 00:44:55,340 that we've been sending up there it's 930 00:45:02,589 --> 00:44:58,460 quite obvious it would be very obvious 931 00:45:04,720 --> 00:45:02,599 that to other civilizations we are a 932 00:45:08,380 --> 00:45:04,730 dangerous planet we're a little violent 933 00:45:11,290 --> 00:45:08,390 where we don't deserve to be invited 934 00:45:12,880 --> 00:45:11,300 into the Federation of Planets yet now 935 00:45:15,910 --> 00:45:12,890 now that we're speaking on this topic 936 00:45:19,810 --> 00:45:15,920 yeah I'm sure you've heard Robert 937 00:45:23,050 --> 00:45:19,820 Hastings talking a lot about and you 938 00:45:24,700 --> 00:45:23,060 know Bob Salas account who by the way 939 00:45:26,230 --> 00:45:24,710 he'll be on next week I think I wrote 940 00:45:29,140 --> 00:45:26,240 you an email that I heard a number of 941 00:45:31,060 --> 00:45:29,150 years ago from someone that I'm saying 942 00:45:33,430 --> 00:45:31,070 25 years ago that he was talking about 943 00:45:39,880 --> 00:45:33,440 this that they were interested in our 944 00:45:43,540 --> 00:45:39,890 nuclear arms yet the government the 945 00:45:48,849 --> 00:45:43,550 military will always deny this kind of 946 00:45:50,829 --> 00:45:48,859 thing and you know lately I've been my 947 00:45:53,770 --> 00:45:50,839 attitude has been changing a little bit 948 00:45:56,740 --> 00:45:53,780 about the whole conspiracy theory about 949 00:45:57,070 --> 00:45:56,750 UFOs and extraterrestrials and why would 950 00:46:07,660 --> 00:45:57,080 they 951 00:46:14,010 --> 00:46:07,670 is I actually think that the not telling 952 00:46:17,650 --> 00:46:14,020 us is is okay because I'm a believer now 953 00:46:19,910 --> 00:46:17,660 that not just the United States but the 954 00:46:24,290 --> 00:46:19,920 the governments of the world 955 00:46:25,970 --> 00:46:24,300 may not know the full picture right 956 00:46:28,790 --> 00:46:25,980 what's happened I've said that a few 957 00:46:33,230 --> 00:46:28,800 times I I agree with you yeah because 958 00:46:37,160 --> 00:46:33,240 and even even guys like Jacques Vallee 959 00:46:39,890 --> 00:46:37,170 John Alexander people who are really 960 00:46:43,030 --> 00:46:39,900 admire and respect they they will they 961 00:46:46,880 --> 00:46:43,040 will say to you this is a very complex 962 00:46:48,560 --> 00:46:46,890 situation it's not just somebody seeing 963 00:46:51,620 --> 00:46:48,570 lights in the sky that look like they're 964 00:46:53,980 --> 00:46:51,630 in the shape of a triangle it may have 965 00:46:56,720 --> 00:46:53,990 something to do with with more and more 966 00:47:00,470 --> 00:46:56,730 abduction experiences that people claim 967 00:47:03,140 --> 00:47:00,480 to have not everybody is lying about 968 00:47:04,790 --> 00:47:03,150 their experiences not everybody is 969 00:47:09,260 --> 00:47:04,800 making it up not everybody is 970 00:47:12,800 --> 00:47:09,270 hallucinating that gets to a point where 971 00:47:16,310 --> 00:47:12,810 you have to keep it really simple and 972 00:47:19,130 --> 00:47:16,320 and my belief is that the government 973 00:47:22,870 --> 00:47:19,140 doesn't fully know that there are people 974 00:47:25,190 --> 00:47:22,880 who are claiming that at some point 975 00:47:27,470 --> 00:47:25,200 decades ago that the United States 976 00:47:30,440 --> 00:47:27,480 government made a deal with 977 00:47:33,020 --> 00:47:30,450 extraterrestrials to allow them to 978 00:47:37,250 --> 00:47:33,030 abduct some of our people some of our 979 00:47:39,380 --> 00:47:37,260 citizens in exchange for new technology 980 00:47:41,150 --> 00:47:39,390 you know what I got it I got to stop you 981 00:47:45,500 --> 00:47:41,160 right here for a second because okay I 982 00:47:48,380 --> 00:47:45,510 have the a friend from Russia who just 983 00:47:50,750 --> 00:47:48,390 told me this afternoon yeah that they 984 00:47:54,350 --> 00:47:50,760 heard the very same exact story in 985 00:47:56,270 --> 00:47:54,360 Russia back in the 1950s and it was for 986 00:47:58,490 --> 00:47:56,280 the exact thing in exchange for 987 00:48:01,730 --> 00:47:58,500 technology and the more you hear these 988 00:48:05,300 --> 00:48:01,740 kinds of stories my my my belief gets 989 00:48:08,630 --> 00:48:05,310 stronger in that how can can the 990 00:48:11,900 --> 00:48:08,640 government or any government tell the 991 00:48:15,530 --> 00:48:11,910 population that this may be going on 992 00:48:19,130 --> 00:48:15,540 that that would cause more panic than 993 00:48:21,320 --> 00:48:19,140 anything than anything like UFOs just 994 00:48:23,390 --> 00:48:21,330 appearing everywhere all at once the 995 00:48:26,830 --> 00:48:23,400 idea that there could be an agreement 996 00:48:28,880 --> 00:48:26,840 between Earth's leaders and 997 00:48:32,580 --> 00:48:28,890 extraterrestrials to actually look take 998 00:48:37,240 --> 00:48:32,590 some of our people like really 999 00:48:39,790 --> 00:48:37,250 so I don't know if that's true a couple 1000 00:48:42,210 --> 00:48:39,800 years ago I I did an interview one of 1001 00:48:45,100 --> 00:48:42,220 many interviews with my friend Nick Pope 1002 00:48:48,610 --> 00:48:45,110 and you listeners probably know who Nick 1003 00:48:51,550 --> 00:48:48,620 is he he for three years in the 1990s he 1004 00:48:53,740 --> 00:48:51,560 he was he was running what was called 1005 00:48:59,260 --> 00:48:53,750 the UFO office of the Ministry of 1006 00:49:02,760 --> 00:48:59,270 Defense in England and he never talking 1007 00:49:05,920 --> 00:49:02,770 about it various things his 1008 00:49:08,470 --> 00:49:05,930 responsibility was to read through and 1009 00:49:12,790 --> 00:49:08,480 go through every UFO report that came 1010 00:49:16,920 --> 00:49:12,800 across his desk and he was told that in 1011 00:49:19,540 --> 00:49:16,930 every wave form fashion that he could to 1012 00:49:22,300 --> 00:49:19,550 contact the media and to make these 1013 00:49:25,690 --> 00:49:22,310 stories go away and to explain them all 1014 00:49:29,500 --> 00:49:25,700 the best way possible and he said and we 1015 00:49:31,420 --> 00:49:29,510 we we called this process spin and dirty 1016 00:49:34,240 --> 00:49:31,430 tricks and I said what does that mean 1017 00:49:38,050 --> 00:49:34,250 spinning dirty tricks he said we were 1018 00:49:41,380 --> 00:49:38,060 charged I was charged with making these 1019 00:49:44,980 --> 00:49:41,390 UFO stories go away just like the air 1020 00:49:46,600 --> 00:49:44,990 force was with Project Blue Book so I so 1021 00:49:49,560 --> 00:49:46,610 I said I took it a step further and I 1022 00:49:51,160 --> 00:49:49,570 said all right what does that entail 1023 00:49:54,430 --> 00:49:51,170 making it go away 1024 00:49:57,210 --> 00:49:54,440 and Nick said to me well it was part of 1025 00:50:02,680 --> 00:49:57,220 my responsibility part of my job to 1026 00:50:03,940 --> 00:50:02,690 ridicule people to to to deny that these 1027 00:50:07,780 --> 00:50:03,950 things that they claimed that they saw 1028 00:50:11,070 --> 00:50:07,790 to deny it ever happen to make them feel 1029 00:50:13,870 --> 00:50:11,080 foolish and and to in some cases even 1030 00:50:15,160 --> 00:50:13,880 ruin their lives because they dared just 1031 00:50:17,650 --> 00:50:15,170 speak out about something that they 1032 00:50:21,430 --> 00:50:17,660 experienced what they saw and I said 1033 00:50:24,220 --> 00:50:21,440 Nick that's a terrible thing that you 1034 00:50:27,880 --> 00:50:24,230 did and that even the United States the 1035 00:50:30,850 --> 00:50:27,890 the famous Robertson panel that dr. J 1036 00:50:34,720 --> 00:50:30,860 Allen Hynek was a part of part of what 1037 00:50:38,590 --> 00:50:34,730 they were supposed to do was to make UFO 1038 00:50:42,070 --> 00:50:38,600 stories go away ridicule ridicule people 1039 00:50:44,610 --> 00:50:42,080 so I said to Nick what was behind that 1040 00:50:46,770 --> 00:50:44,620 why did you do these 1041 00:50:51,810 --> 00:50:46,780 dirty tricks he said well it was very 1042 00:50:53,670 --> 00:50:51,820 simple we were at a time when many 1043 00:50:57,180 --> 00:50:53,680 people were reporting things in the 1044 00:51:02,040 --> 00:50:57,190 skies including airline pilots there was 1045 00:51:03,210 --> 00:51:02,050 a possibility of of airline safety that 1046 00:51:07,350 --> 00:51:03,220 could become an issue 1047 00:51:10,560 --> 00:51:07,360 and the the British government could not 1048 00:51:13,260 --> 00:51:10,570 figure out a way to tell the population 1049 00:51:17,010 --> 00:51:13,270 that there were things operating in our 1050 00:51:19,500 --> 00:51:17,020 skies that we had no control over that 1051 00:51:20,010 --> 00:51:19,510 we could not catch we could not pin them 1052 00:51:22,650 --> 00:51:20,020 down 1053 00:51:25,080 --> 00:51:22,660 we couldn't even chase them we couldn't 1054 00:51:27,990 --> 00:51:25,090 tell the public that we were having this 1055 00:51:30,630 --> 00:51:28,000 problem so we were then told to just 1056 00:51:32,400 --> 00:51:30,640 ridicule all the sightings instead you 1057 00:51:35,820 --> 00:51:32,410 know like end of story 1058 00:51:39,840 --> 00:51:35,830 really and you know and and and to some 1059 00:51:42,300 --> 00:51:39,850 degree Martin I I hate to say this and 1060 00:51:46,160 --> 00:51:42,310 people would get pissed with me but I 1061 00:51:49,560 --> 00:51:46,170 don't care I can almost understand why 1062 00:51:52,590 --> 00:51:49,570 governments would do that if you you 1063 00:51:55,110 --> 00:51:52,600 know your Air Force is charged with the 1064 00:51:57,300 --> 00:51:55,120 safety and the security of your nation 1065 00:51:58,680 --> 00:51:57,310 especially from the skies and if 1066 00:52:01,950 --> 00:51:58,690 something is coming in and out of your 1067 00:52:05,430 --> 00:52:01,960 airspace that you cannot control or have 1068 00:52:07,770 --> 00:52:05,440 any any power over of course people will 1069 00:52:10,590 --> 00:52:07,780 get nervous and afraid of them 1070 00:52:12,180 --> 00:52:10,600 so so to get around that you do what you 1071 00:52:14,460 --> 00:52:12,190 can to try and make people think that 1072 00:52:19,140 --> 00:52:14,470 there's nothing to it just like back in 1073 00:52:22,170 --> 00:52:19,150 1952 and that's each yeah exactly that's 1074 00:52:25,920 --> 00:52:22,180 exactly right yeah and so so I get there 1075 00:52:29,370 --> 00:52:25,930 I I get the attitude that that that's 1076 00:52:31,860 --> 00:52:29,380 what's probably going on you hear all 1077 00:52:33,720 --> 00:52:31,870 these people talking about well there's 1078 00:52:35,760 --> 00:52:33,730 a there's like another government that's 1079 00:52:37,380 --> 00:52:35,770 controlling things if you don't it's at 1080 00:52:39,210 --> 00:52:37,390 the highest level and the president of 1081 00:52:41,940 --> 00:52:39,220 the United States doesn't have a need to 1082 00:52:43,920 --> 00:52:41,950 know it's such a rich senator well let 1083 00:52:46,950 --> 00:52:43,930 me let me very well be the president may 1084 00:52:48,690 --> 00:52:46,960 not have I need to know that there are 1085 00:52:52,880 --> 00:52:48,700 other people that are controlling the 1086 00:52:57,069 --> 00:52:52,890 government well maybe that's true 1087 00:52:59,589 --> 00:52:57,079 somebody is controlling something 1088 00:53:02,140 --> 00:52:59,599 it's like Jacques Vallee in some of the 1089 00:53:04,750 --> 00:53:02,150 earlier books that he wrote a very smart 1090 00:53:08,710 --> 00:53:04,760 very very smart thinker about UFOs 1091 00:53:11,020 --> 00:53:08,720 what would consider that the whole UFO 1092 00:53:13,660 --> 00:53:11,030 phenomenon has something to do with 1093 00:53:18,400 --> 00:53:13,670 projections that something is being 1094 00:53:21,609 --> 00:53:18,410 projected into our reality to play 1095 00:53:23,799 --> 00:53:21,619 tricks on us to show themselves and I 1096 00:53:27,960 --> 00:53:23,809 once I once said to Jacque well if 1097 00:53:30,400 --> 00:53:27,970 that's true who's running the projector 1098 00:53:32,920 --> 00:53:30,410 right you know I mean you can take you 1099 00:53:36,480 --> 00:53:32,930 you can take this step as far as you 1100 00:53:40,230 --> 00:53:36,490 want and really going all the way back 1101 00:53:44,500 --> 00:53:40,240 thousands of years ago early UFO 1102 00:53:46,420 --> 00:53:44,510 encounters in my in my presentations I 1103 00:53:51,430 --> 00:53:46,430 do a thing at the beginning of my talk 1104 00:53:53,890 --> 00:53:51,440 where I say to people UFO reports I say 1105 00:53:57,760 --> 00:53:53,900 I'm I feel like I'm very proud to be 1106 00:53:59,890 --> 00:53:57,770 part of a profession that reports and 1107 00:54:02,049 --> 00:53:59,900 tries to get accurate information out to 1108 00:54:05,079 --> 00:54:02,059 the public about UFOs and it's a 1109 00:54:09,220 --> 00:54:05,089 profession that goes all the way back to 1110 00:54:11,349 --> 00:54:09,230 the time when humans before there were 1111 00:54:14,200 --> 00:54:11,359 newspapers and television and radios 1112 00:54:16,150 --> 00:54:14,210 humans still wanted to report the things 1113 00:54:18,039 --> 00:54:16,160 that went on in their daily lives so 1114 00:54:21,010 --> 00:54:18,049 they painted these things onto cave 1115 00:54:22,839 --> 00:54:21,020 walls you know talk about Seth Shostak I 1116 00:54:26,740 --> 00:54:22,849 mentioned that to him we had sort of a 1117 00:54:31,750 --> 00:54:26,750 UFO debate and and he said well my kids 1118 00:54:33,370 --> 00:54:31,760 were drawing stuff like that too so I 1119 00:54:35,349 --> 00:54:33,380 agree and I've said a number of times 1120 00:54:37,720 --> 00:54:35,359 and not to be redundant on this show but 1121 00:54:40,289 --> 00:54:37,730 the way the timings go with 1122 00:54:43,270 --> 00:54:40,299 civilizations advanced civilizations 1123 00:54:44,950 --> 00:54:43,280 that are possibly out there they could 1124 00:54:47,170 --> 00:54:44,960 have been visiting us millions of years 1125 00:54:49,120 --> 00:54:47,180 ago yes I mean it wouldn't make any 1126 00:54:51,940 --> 00:54:49,130 difference really in the scope of things 1127 00:54:53,470 --> 00:54:51,950 that that's right there was a thing that 1128 00:54:55,930 --> 00:54:53,480 just happened in the news just this week 1129 00:54:57,339 --> 00:54:55,940 I forget where the cave was but some 1130 00:55:00,099 --> 00:54:57,349 cave was discovered and there were 1131 00:55:04,420 --> 00:55:00,109 pictures showing what apparently the 1132 00:55:08,049 --> 00:55:04,430 oldest ever paintings of hands and arms 1133 00:55:08,380 --> 00:55:08,059 dating back 40,000 years yes I saw in 1134 00:55:11,259 --> 00:55:08,390 the news 1135 00:55:14,019 --> 00:55:11,269 this week that's right I say I could say 1136 00:55:16,089 --> 00:55:14,029 the audience's here in New York where I 1137 00:55:18,309 --> 00:55:16,099 live we we have this very famous paper 1138 00:55:20,440 --> 00:55:18,319 the New York Times and its motto has 1139 00:55:21,009 --> 00:55:20,450 always been all the news that's fit to 1140 00:55:24,370 --> 00:55:21,019 print 1141 00:55:26,170 --> 00:55:24,380 well I say they stole that motto from 1142 00:55:28,450 --> 00:55:26,180 from early cave-dweller 1143 00:55:30,849 --> 00:55:28,460 who basically did all the news that's 1144 00:55:32,829 --> 00:55:30,859 fit to paint yeah exactly 1145 00:55:35,200 --> 00:55:32,839 Haley I got a question I'm gonna put you 1146 00:55:37,660 --> 00:55:35,210 right in the spot okay do it will you 1147 00:55:47,460 --> 00:55:37,670 come back on well let's say you're gonna 1148 00:55:51,609 --> 00:55:50,140 that's I hope you come back on because I 1149 00:55:54,819 --> 00:55:51,619 feel like I just scratched the surface 1150 00:55:56,650 --> 00:55:54,829 and we're out of time well I would love 1151 00:55:59,680 --> 00:55:56,660 to come back because obviously we should 1152 00:56:02,470 --> 00:55:59,690 get into how I brought the UFOs to the 1153 00:56:04,120 --> 00:56:02,480 United Nations that that was a whole yes 1154 00:56:06,490 --> 00:56:04,130 I wanted to talk about that 1155 00:56:08,319 --> 00:56:06,500 and where can someone find your your 1156 00:56:10,900 --> 00:56:08,329 website and of course on the huffington 1157 00:56:14,529 --> 00:56:10,910 post's right well you know they can they 1158 00:56:16,299 --> 00:56:14,539 can go to li Spiegel calm and you can 1159 00:56:19,089 --> 00:56:16,309 spell Lee and Spiegel any way you want 1160 00:56:20,680 --> 00:56:19,099 you'll get to my smite webpage there are 1161 00:56:23,740 --> 00:56:20,690 some interesting things about a variety 1162 00:56:26,400 --> 00:56:23,750 of things that I did so far to help get 1163 00:56:30,009 --> 00:56:26,410 more information out about UFOs 1164 00:56:31,749 --> 00:56:30,019 Huffington Post my my direct email there 1165 00:56:37,049 --> 00:56:31,759 if people want to contact me it's Lee 1166 00:56:41,559 --> 00:56:37,059 got spiegel that's SP ee i GTL at 1167 00:56:43,539 --> 00:56:41,569 huffingtonpost.com and and you can find 1168 00:56:46,450 --> 00:56:43,549 out what I'm up to with my stories and 1169 00:56:47,829 --> 00:56:46,460 I'm Martin thank you it's about time 1170 00:56:48,759 --> 00:56:47,839 that you and I had a chance to talk 1171 00:56:51,579 --> 00:56:48,769 that's right 1172 00:56:54,519 --> 00:56:51,589 all right Lee until until next time I'm 1173 00:56:56,620 --> 00:56:54,529 going to say along with you and really 1174 00:56:58,630 --> 00:56:56,630 you don't have you people call me we'll 1175 00:57:00,249 --> 00:56:58,640 just do it alright sounds good alright 1176 00:57:03,009 --> 00:57:00,259 that's it for our show we'll be back 1177 00:57:06,190 --> 00:57:03,019 next week live with Peter Robbins and 1178 00:57:08,200 --> 00:57:06,200 Robert Salas I want to thank people for 1179 00:57:10,569 --> 00:57:08,210 helping out with show today Keith Roland 1180 00:57:13,539 --> 00:57:10,579 for producing the dark matter EO Network 1181 00:57:15,730 --> 00:57:13,549 our guests of course Lee Spiegel I want 1182 00:57:18,730 --> 00:57:15,740 to thank Peggy shunning for admitting 1183 00:57:21,130 --> 00:57:18,740 the Facebook page and if you want to get 1184 00:57:21,730 --> 00:57:21,140 all the latest UFO news and astronomy 1185 00:57:23,830 --> 00:57:21,740 news 1186 00:57:25,690 --> 00:57:23,840 check this out on Facebook and like us 1187 00:57:27,520 --> 00:57:25,700 thanks again and we'll see you right